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May 17, 2008 Est 1999 Scotland's award-winning independent newspaper
SUNDAY HERALD: EDITORIAL

IN 1979, when the rest of the United Kingdom began its lengthy love affair with Margaret Thatcher and Thatcherite politics, Scotland maintained its loyalty to a fading party that looked more and more unelectable. In 1994, when Tony Blair effectively disbanded the Labour Party and created New Labour, with Gordon Brown at his side, Scotland's loyalty - or patience, depending on how you saw it - looked like it would be eventually rewarded.

New Labour's triumph in 1997 and the dawn of devolved power was that long-awaited reward for Scotland, a place where you didn't count Labour votes, you weighed them. Factored into every Labour electoral calculation was an assumption of compliance north of the Border. Scotland was a country that for a generation looked like it was content to vote for a party that would deliver little.

Now, as the political pendulum swings away from Labour and back towards Conservatism, anyone expecting Scotland to resume business as usual will be disappointed. The massacre of Gordon Brown's party in the local elections in England and Wales, and the high-profile victory of the Old Etonian Tory, Boris Johnson, in the London mayoral vote, points to a now almost certain return of the Tories to power in Westminster come the next general election.

This weekend in traditional Labour heartlands in northern England, and in die-hard Labour constituencies in Wales, the Conservatives, after Labour's worst showing in nearly half a century, have planted their conquering blue flags. As a consequence, Brown is now a lame duck prime minister, with David Cameron the effective PM-elect.

Although no polling took place in Scotland, it is entirely reasonable to ask where the anti-Brown vote would have gone here. London, it's often said, is the political locus that predicts what's to come later in the rest of the UK. However, last year in the Scottish parliamentary vote, the election of Alex Salmond as first minister and head of a Nationalist administration in Holyrood offered a serious hint at what was to come when England and Wales next voted on a failing Labour government.

For Scotland, come the general election there will be no swing to the Conservatives. While Tories in England and Wales have survived like a desert plant hibernating and waiting for water, in Scotland the species has been beyond any natural revival for some decades now. A parallel collapse in Labour's Scottish core vote will mean only one thing: further gains for the SNP and an extension of their powerbase outward from Holyrood.

For Labour in Scotland, the disastrous results of last week's local elections in England and Wales and the catastrophe of losing London should not be a case of thank-God-it-wasn't-us voting. If any constituent part of the Labour Party should be breaking out in a sweat at what happened on May 1, it should be Labour in Scotland. Whether Gordon Brown makes it to a general election or is deposed in an effort to minimise the parliamentary casualties, Scotland will not simply troop to the polls and vote for a party that cannot deliver. That political era is gone.

And in its place is an electorate expecting genuine representation and delivery. Salmond broke up the comfort zone for New Labour last year, and the SNP will do the same come the general election unless there is a radical rethink on what Labour is, what it stands for, what it can achieve and where it is going.

If Brown remains in Number 10, fiddles with peripheral, inconsequential policies, and his party simply prays for a miracle, Scotland will not ride to Labour's rescue unquestioningly.

CAMERON as prime minister would introduce "English votes for English laws" and quickly turn Westminster into an English-led parliament where Scottish MPs would be marginalised as second-class members, limited in ambition and office. Many Scottish Labour MPs would begin questioning their effectiveness in representing constituencies north of the Border. An alliance of Nationalist and Scottish Labour MPs looks unthinkable at the moment, but after a few years of a Cameron-led Tory landslide administration that began redrawing the constitutional framework of the union, who knows?

Time may have already been called on Gordon Brown. His party no longer controls the administration that runs the streets outside Number 10, and in his Fife constituency power lies elsewhere. With councils throughout England and Wales lost by Labour, Brown remains a prime minister in office, but what exactly is he running, what does he control? Not London, not large parts of England and Wales, and certainly not Scotland.

He is a prime minister whose authority is limited, whose electability is very limited, and crucially, whose time in power is certainly limited. Labour MPs around him have a clear and uncomfortable choice: they can wait for the axe to fall heavily on the entire New Labour project come the general election, or they can begin now to lay the foundations for life beyond Blair and Brown.

Do nothing and Labour, like the Tories before them, will find denial comes wrapped up with a lengthy period in opposition.

Their future, and indeed the future of the United Kingdom, is tied up in the same decision.

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Posted by: Mrs I P Knightly on 11:43pm Sat 3 May 08
SUNDAY HEARALD: EDITORIAL - dearie me - education, education, education..........
Posted by: Duns Scotus, The Borders on 11:52pm Sat 3 May 08
turn Westminster into an English-led parliament where Scottish MPs would be marginalised as second-class members
It's been that for 300 bloody years - where have you been Mr Editor?
Posted by: subrosa on 11:53pm Sat 3 May 08
Hasn't done them much good at the Herald office has it Mrs K. Does nobody proof read online articles?
Posted by: Duns Scotus, The Borders on 11:55pm Sat 3 May 08
Their future, and indeed the future of the United Kingdom, is tied up in the same decision.
The future of the United Kingdomn is already settled - it is DEAD. All that remains is the burial.

Posted by: Mrs I P Knightly on 11:55pm Sat 3 May 08
subrosa wrote:
Hasn't done them much good at the Herald office has it Mrs K. Does nobody proof read online articles?
now corrected by the editorial staff I presume
Posted by: subrosa on 12:06am Sun 4 May 08
And not even a thank you Mrs K. Now in my day ...[
Posted by: The Union's Grave-digger on 12:08am Sun 4 May 08
Just marking out the turf.....
Posted by: Jim Mitchell, sauchie, clacks on 12:32am Sun 4 May 08
The biggest obsticle to the SNP come the next general election won't be the Labour party or any of the other unionist partys as usual it will be those Scottish media hacks who are
still willing to do their work for them, and who in spite of everything will still be tempted to say only a vote for Labour can keep the Tories out or back the union, vote Labour

Where will the Sunday Herald stand then?
Posted by: Duns Scotus, The Borders on 12:37am Sun 4 May 08
The Union's Grave-digger wrote:
Just marking out the turf.....
Tomb it may concern .... well done!
Posted by: Nat Liars on 12:44am Sun 4 May 08
What an ignorant editorial. The Tories in Wales are every bit as marginalised as in Scotland. They took one council - that's all - last week and have poor representation in the Welsh Assembly.

YouGov - who forecast the London result exactly - produced a poll last week showing the SNP winning nine Westminster seats - far from Salmond's target of twenty. And gianing just three more seats at Holyrood.

And that is after what SNP propagandists call their most successful year. Time maybe for the nat nutters to ask whey their party can't do as well in Scotland as the Tories in England.

Twice as many people voted for Boris Johnson as stuck their crosses beside Salmond for FM last year.

Yet their own preferred pollsters show gains of just three at both Holyrood and Westminster? If that's the best they can do when Labour is at its lowest and the Liberals scarcely registering, there is no chance of a referendum any time soon.

Posted by: doonhamer on 12:49am Sun 4 May 08
I hope the burial is in England for it would be waste of good Scottish land to hold this charade of a union.
Posted by: Professor Hertz Van Rental on 12:51am Sun 4 May 08
Twice as many people voted for Boris Johnson as stuck their crosses beside Salmond for FM last year

the Nat Liar chappie needs to look up some reference books. The population of London is a lot more that Scotland. What a soor puss he is is. Sucking on lemons for entertainment no doubt.
Posted by: Im no really here on 12:57am Sun 4 May 08
An alliance of Nationalist an
d Scottish&#81
94;Labour MPs looks unthinkable at the moment, but after a few years of a Cameron-led Tory landslide admi
nistration tha
t began redrawing the constitutional framework of the union, who knows?
Is this the ONLY future you see for Scotland. Shows that you still have your Labour tinted glasses still firmly in place Mr Editor. The future of Scotland is not dependant on some Toom Tabard Labour MP's.

Also, please inform Mr Cameron that the ONLY Scottish MP's that voted for English Laws were his own Conservative, Labour and LibDems. The SNP had had a policy for some time on excusing themselves from votes on purely English matters. Now if we could get all English MP's to do the same regarding Scottish matters.....
Posted by: Im no really here on 1:00am Sun 4 May 08
An alliance of Nationalist an
d Scottish&#81
94;Labour MPs looks unthinkable at the moment, but after a few years of a Cameron-led Tory landslide admi
nistration tha
t began redrawing the constitutional framework of the union, who knows?
Is this the ONLY future you see for Scotland. Shows that you still have your Labour tinted glasses still firmly in place Mr Editor. The future of Scotland is not dependant on some Toom Tabard Labour MP's.

Also, please inform Mr Cameron that the ONLY Scottish MP's that voted for English Laws were his own Conservative, Labour and LibDems. The SNP had had a policy for some time on excusing themselves from votes on purely English matters. Now if we could get all English MP's to do the same regarding Scottish matters.....
Posted by: paul h, fife on 1:03am Sun 4 May 08
Wonderful editorial, very refreshing to see a newspaper that has a perspective on reality and a finger on the pulse.

Nat Liars- you won't be 'gianing' any friends or influencing any people with nonesense like that!
Posted by: Edward, Edinburgh on 1:25am Sun 4 May 08
This strangely reminds me of a scene from the'Titanic' after its holed bellow the water line , engines stopped, bow tilting into the water, the String quartet playing on deck. Replace 'Titanic' with 'United Kingdom' and replace the the string quartet with Gordon Brown and his cabinet moving the deckchairs about, while everyone is jumping ship.
With the 'Titanic' it ended up breaking its back and sank into the depths of the cold atlantic, which is also the inevitable outcome of the United Kingdom
Posted by: Colkitto, River Clyde on 3:00am Sun 4 May 08
C'mon unionist media. The UK game is bust. Give the SNP & Salmond a hand and put this old beast that's called Great Britain to sleep.
Posted by: izzie, dundee on 7:40am Sun 4 May 08
'Scotland will not simply troop to the polls and vote for a party that cannot deliver. That political era has gone.

Gone forever because the SNP have shown all of us how a country should be governed and how third rate the previous administrations were. Look at Wendy Alexander's dismal showing during FMQ tine Thursday nothing new to say no alternative strategy it is a tired approach which is sickening the electorate both sides of the border.
Posted by: Oscar on 9:01am Sun 4 May 08
Ahem, Mr Nat Liar, I refer you to the TNS poll as commissioned by yesterdays Herald.


The TNS/System Three poll details are:

* Scottish Parliament constituency vote (change since 2007 in brackets)

SNP: 45% (+12)
Lab: 31% (-1)
Con: 12% (-5)
Lib: 11% (-5)

* Scottish Parliament regional vote (change since 2007 in brackets)

SNP: 41% (+10)
Lab: 29% (-)
Con: 12% (-2)
Lib: 12% (+1)
Grn: 4%
Oth: 2%

* Holyrood seats projection:

SNP: 62 (+15)
Lab: 39 (-7)
Con: 13 (-4)
Lib: 13 (-3)
Grn: 2 (-)

* Westminster General Election (change since 2005 in brackets)

SNP: 31% (+13)
Lab: 39% (-1)
Con: 17% (+1)
Lib: 10% (-13)

TNS/System Three polled 1,086 adults between the 26th and 29th of April
Posted by: Duns Scotus, The Borders on 9:41am Sun 4 May 08
Nat Pliers @ 12:44am says,
YouGov - who forecast the London result exactly - produced a poll last week showing the SNP winning nine Westminster seats - far from Salmond's target of twenty
Forget last week, it's what will happen in the next two years.

Bean's on toast and his MPs are all now digging escape tunnels. When the next UK election comes there will be one main question for Scots voters - Who will protect Scotland from the inevitable Anglocentric Tory government?

Clue: The answer is not Labour.
Posted by: Old Tam, Glasgow on 10:14am Sun 4 May 08
The opening paragraph above is how I remember it, Scots waiting for their reward/compensation from their guardian, the Labour Party. Now however the Labour government has run its course. With the end of Brown, with Smith & Dewar long dead, perhaps we can focus our time and energy on supporting the great advances made by the Government of Scotland rather than supporting the London focused careers of a few self-seekers in our society.
Posted by: Jwil, Lanarkshire on 10:32am Sun 4 May 08
You immediately get the impression from comments from Jack Straw and Gordon Brown that labour will just steam ahead with the same policies, say they are listening, and hope no one will notice. Labour are unchastened and have learned nothing, even with their demise staring them in the face.
Posted by: Im no really here on 11:52am Sun 4 May 08
Duns Scotus, The Borders on 9:41am wrote:
Who will protect Scotland from the inevitable Anglocentric Tory government?
Well said. You have predicted the SNP GE campaign, backed by their record of government in Scotland. The SNP are the ONLY party whose SOLE interest is Scotland. None other can claim that.
Posted by: Buckpool Loon, Cheshire on 12:29pm Sun 4 May 08
The fact Londoners voted for a buffoon like Johnson raises more questions than it provides answers.

Are they so disillusioned by the word Labour that they would have voted for a chimp in a shell suit?

What does it say for a political party to sponser and support such a ridiculous candidate? And what does it say for that same party's claim to be capable of governing a country?

Johnson's election as Mayor of London is an indictment on the vipers nest of Westminster politics and its cabal of party allegence.

The most significant result last Wedensday, was not the losses or gains by the usual tripartite players - we all know how duplicous and ineffective they are - but the election of 300+ independent councillors in Wales.

The significant trait of all contempory governments in the UK have been one of failure.

Scotland has a chance to breach this spirel of ineffective governance. And perhaps, by doing so will induce better and more equitable governance on the residual parts of this Island.
Posted by: Jim Mitchell, sauchie, clacks on 12:29pm Sun 4 May 08
I see that the Sunday Mail is reporting that there is supposed to be a drive within the Labour party to have a snap referendum on independence to put the SNP's gas at a peep.

How like a unionist party.

These concerns, if true, follow not the result of last years Holyrood elections but the locals in Engalnd and Wales and the London Mayoral contest.

They are being put forward not in the interest of Scotland but in the hope that through fear it will protect the interests of the Labour party.

Would Gordon Brown have the nerve to risk all on a single throw of the dice, even if backed by all the other unionst crews and their tame media hacks?

We all know how indicisive he is, a man who would rather disapear than make a concrete decision, how he must be suffering at the thought of trying to second guess the opinion polls, how would he go down in history?

The Sunday Mail editorial is doing it's best to help him though, it's advising that he shouldn't touch the idea with a barge-poll, strange that considering how little support unionists keep telling us there is for independence, but as I have said many times before, strange people these unionists.



Posted by: Proud to be Scottish, Glasgow on 1:09pm Sun 4 May 08
When Britain first, at Heaven's command
Arose from out the azure main;
This was the charter of the land,
And guardian angels sung this strain:

"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves:
"Britons never will be slaves."

The nations, not so blest as thee,
Must, in their turns, to tyrants fall;
While thou shalt flourish great and free,
The dread and envy of them all.

"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves:
"Britons never will be slaves."

Still more majestic shalt thou rise,
More dreadful, from each foreign stroke;
As the loud blast that tears the skies,
Serves but to root thy native oak.

"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves:
"Britons never will be slaves."

Thee haughty tyrants ne'er shall tame:
All their attempts to bend thee down,
Will but arouse thy generous flame;
But work their woe, and thy renown.

"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves:
"Britons never will be slaves."

To thee belongs the rural reign;
Thy cities shall with commerce shine:
All thine shall be the subject main,
And every shore it circles thine.

"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves:
"Britons never will be slaves."

The Muses, still with freedom found,
Shall to thy happy coast repair;
Blest Isle! With matchless beauty crown'd,
And manly hearts to guard the fair.

"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves:
"Britons never will be slaves."
Posted by: Scott, Inverness on 1:28pm Sun 4 May 08
Just saw Wendy and Alex on Politics show one what they wan't for Scotland and standing up for us the other moaning and whinging but nothing else the voice really puts you off,why is it the the BBC people like Glen Campbell are so soft on Wendy do we read something into his last word we heard to her was ok??? maybe not meant to hear that.
Posted by: Observer on 2:12pm Sun 4 May 08
A good editorial, at least there is one paper in Scotland that I can actually buy as opposed to reading on line. Proud to be a dipstick was there a point to that song ? It just makes me think of last night of the proms, which I occasionally watch because I love to despise the collected masses of bobbing up and down idiots so much it's a pleasure.
Posted by: megz, glasgow on 2:26pm Sun 4 May 08
fairly balanced editorial, the best thing labour could do north and south of the border is to get rid of their lame duck leaders. Hopefully they will continue 'listening' and completely disregard everyone's opinion and carry on to a hiding to nothing.
Posted by: scotsland only 8% of the UK population, Glasgow on 2:53pm Sun 4 May 08
Posted by: Buckpool Loon, Cheshire on 12:29pm today
The fact Londoners voted for a buffoon like Johnson raises more questions than it provides answers.



How many voted for that obese guy running scotsland today ?


Posted by: Morag, Peeblesshire on 3:09pm Sun 4 May 08
How many voted for that obese guy running scotsland today ?
When the troll has to stoop to personal insult, we know he's beat.

Posted by: Wardog, Buckie on 4:33pm Sun 4 May 08
scotsland only 8% of the UK population wrote:
Posted by: Buckpool Loon, Cheshire on 12:29pm today
The fact Londoners voted for a buffoon like Johnson raises more questions than it provides answers.



How many voted for that obese guy running scotsland today ?


Can you tell us the difference in public expenditure per capita between London & Scotland?

C'mon 8% do tell. Red Ken was civil enough to admit it.

You are aware that Scotland accounts for just over 30% of the land area of the UK, can you tell us what percentage London is?
Posted by: pehman, sussex on 4:53pm Sun 4 May 08
Yes THIS IS THE STORY I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR.

The political reality of just what has happened.

In the past few days much has been kept back from the Scottish public about the scale of labours melt down.

It's ironic that the media have focused on the one year in power of the SNP rather than print the casualty figures of the labour party.

During the Eng/Wales local elections, labour lost 331 cllr's and with them went crediblity, but it seems to have escaped everybody's attention that Eng/Wales had local elections just 12 months ago, in the way the system works down here. In these elections labour lost around 250 cllrs.

So that the combined total of labour casualties in one year is just under 600, but you also have to factor in the losses in Scotland in the local election body count which I think from memory were also around the 200+ mark.

Remember also what slab's own tom mccabe said just a couple of months back. That the lose of the council seats was the lose many jobs for the boy's which meant that trying to get people to be active and move up the political ladder had also been lost.
Added to their mis-fortune was many ex-cllrs did not re-new their membership, and overall slab membership has halved in 9 years.

The lose of credibility will also cost them with the Trade unions, who you can be sure, do not see this melt down as merely a blip.
The TU's were ignored by blair/brown on their way up, remember brown at the STUC last month, the 1st time a labour leader had been there in 24 years.

This my fellow Nat's is the story we will be fighting the general election on, this and the VERY positive message of what the SNP HAVE DONE and will continue to do.
Posted by: Hall Of Montezuma, Shores Of Whiting Bay on 5:34pm Sun 4 May 08
Proud to be Scottish wrote:
When Britain first, at Heaven\'s command Arose from out the azure main; This was the charter of the land, And guardian angels sung this strain: \"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves: \"Britons never will be slaves.\" The nations, not so blest as thee, Must, in their turns, to tyrants fall; While thou shalt flourish great and free, The dread and envy of them all. \"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves: \"Britons never will be slaves.\" Still more majestic shalt thou rise, More dreadful, from each foreign stroke; As the loud blast that tears the skies, Serves but to root thy native oak. \"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves: \"Britons never will be slaves.\" Thee haughty tyrants ne\'er shall tame: All their attempts to bend thee down, Will but arouse thy generous flame; But work their woe, and thy renown. \"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves: \"Britons never will be slaves.\" To thee belongs the rural reign; Thy cities shall with commerce shine: All thine shall be the subject main, And every shore it circles thine. \"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves: \"Britons never will be slaves.\" The Muses, still with freedom found, Shall to thy happy coast repair; Blest Isle! With matchless beauty crown\'d, And manly hearts to guard the fair. \"Rule, Britannia! rule the waves: \"Britons never will be slaves.\"
OK Jason4Queen....you can type...we'll give you that.........anythin

g to say though?
Same as usual then? Nothing of merit
Posted by: scotsland only 8% of the UK population, Glasgow on 5:56pm Sun 4 May 08
Wardog wrote:
scotsland only 8% of the UK population wrote:
Posted by: Buckpool Loon, Cheshire on 12:29pm today The fact Londoners voted for a buffoon like Johnson raises more questions than it provides answers.
How many voted for that obese guy running scotsland today ?
Can you tell us the difference in public expenditure per capita between London & Scotland? C\'mon 8% do tell. Red Ken was civil enough to admit it. You are aware that Scotland accounts for just over 30% of the land area of the UK, can you tell us what percentage London is?
People vote, not land area.

I am aware , just as you, that London contributed £1.9 billion in property stamp duty 2006 , yet scotsland contributed only £247 million.

More men have jobs in Yorkshire and the Humber , than do scots in the wholes country of scotsland

I can tell you that 34% of the unemployed in London are white (may 2007 DWP), yet 85% of the unemployed in scotsland are white.
Posted by: The Answer, Glasgow on 6:21pm Sun 4 May 08
Morag wrote:
How many voted for that obese guy running scotsland today ?
When the troll has to stoop to personal insult, we know he's beat.
So you too have a weight problem, don't worry, after the USA, scotslands woman are the most obese in the world!

Hence the low birth rate statistics I guess!
Posted by: Traquir, Alba on 6:27pm Sun 4 May 08
Looks like British Brown is getting desperate

"Brown To Call SNP Bluff Over Independence Vote"

http://tinyurl.com/3

w7uw8
Posted by: wullie, govan on 8:03pm Sun 4 May 08
Gordon Browns favourite song there,ll always be an england
while there,s a country lane
wherever there,s a cottage small
beside a feild of grain
there,ll always be a england
while there,s a busy street
wherever there,s a turning wheel
a million marching feet

red white and blue
what does it mean to you
surely you,re proud
shout it out loud
britons awake
the empire to
we can depend on you
freedom remains
these are the chains
nothing can break
there,ll always be an england
and england shall be free
if england means as much to you
as england means to me
Posted by: Jim, Irvine on 8:50pm Sun 4 May 08
The Nu Labour and Tory Parties voted for the Iraq War. They costs are crippling Britain ;and
the loss of our 'Heroes' by Death or Injury is
an Albatross round both of their necks.
They have also voted for the replacement of the Trident missile systems which are Illegal.
Without settling the Atomic waste problem they voted for Replacement Nuclear Power stations.
Both are guilty of Donation scandals ;only
the Lib Dems are worth supporting in England.
The SNP only have to Govern as they have being
doing and they will get a increased support in
2010. England are welcome to the NU Lavatory
Party.
Posted by: The Light, North Lanarkshire on 8:50pm Sun 4 May 08
Morag wrote:
How many voted for that obese guy running scotsland today ?
When the troll has to stoop to personal insult, we know he's beat.
Toerag

You know all about insults... don't you.

POT KETTLE BLACK
Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 8:10pm Tue 6 May 08

8% Idiot - 92% Moron
How many voted for that obese guy running scotsland today ?
How many people read your infantile post today?

Three.

You and me, you twice.


Posted by: Los Angeles, Edinburgh on 8:14pm Tue 6 May 08
Not Pliers
Twice as many people voted for Boris Johnson as stuck their crosses beside Salmond for FM last year.
Yes, Londoners love practical jokes.

Posted by: William McGinty, Dundee on 11:32pm Sat 10 May 08
The only way for Labour to survive in Scotland and keep Scotland in the UK is now very probably to go for devolution max, and I mean MAX: power over everything except foreign affairs and defence to come to Scotland.

This would not satisfy me, I hasten to add, but it might satisfy Scottish Labour's core support and enough others to keep the wolf from the door for a time.

It is also a relatively simple formula, almost as simple as what the SNP are selling. The simpler the message the easier it is to convey it. This is valuable free advice, Labour. All you have to do is think about it - don't take too long - and then implement it.

Don't wait for that Brown chap to make up his mind, Ms Alexander. Life is too short. Just bounce him into this radical new policy direction, just as you did so impressively with that independence-referen
dum wheeze. The shock waves from that got you noticed. (Have you seen the cartoon in today's Telegraph, by the way? Yes, you've made quite an impression.) Go for it.
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